Ask An SEO: How Long Does It Take For Schema To Rank? via @sejournal, @rollerblader

This week’s Ask an SEO question comes from Mariya from Irinjalakuda, India, who asks:

“How much time does it take for schema to go live on a SERP?”

Great question Mariya, and an easy one to answer.

Schema “goes live” on a search engine ranking position immediately once the search engine has refreshed its current version of the page which includes a crawl and the index updating with the new code. Once this happens the new code with the schema deployed is shown.

For authoritative pages that get crawled and refreshed regularly, it could be a few hours. With newer sites, it could be a week or two. But schema does not help you rank. The job of schema is to help search engines know what the page is about, what is in each section of the page, and in some cases, why the page should be trusted.

A common misconception about schema is that it is a ranking signal or a magic bullet that helps you gain positions algorithmically.

It does not, adding FAQ schema (which was deprecated and is no longer used by Google at least) did not help you get featured in people also ask results. Instead, it would help search engines know when to add relevant questions under your site’s listing in the SERP which extended the depth of a listing.

If your pages are not already ranking, and the content quality is not good, schema isn’t going to help you. If you do have rankings, deploying proper schema may give you more visibility via featured snippets and rich results.

When FAQ schema did exist, the questions nested to your search result would help you stand out from the pack, so some users may click on your listing vs. the one above you because you were more visible.

Schema can also help recipe sites that have high trust and a great UX to get their recipes shown in a carousel.

If you have a page where the video is the predominant content on the page, and the video matches the topic including the title and H1, using video object schema will signal to the search engine that you have a video about that topic. That video may start to show up at the top of the search results, inside a “people also ask”, “things to know”, or videos search result.

That is where schema can help with SEO, but increased rankings from schema on its own are unlikely.

Schema isn’t there to help you rank, it is there to help search engines know:

  • What your page is about.
  • Who created the content or information within the page.
  • Which queries to show your pages for include informational, service and leads, ecommerce shopping, comparisons, and reviews, as well as music, images, videos, sounds, and media.
  • The types of visitors may have the best experience with that specific page or a section of the page.
  • Where you offer services, the times you offer them, and who they’re best for.

If you’re a local business, you can deploy area served schema to show the area you offer services for. If you operate during specific hours, and modify them for the holidays, this can be shown through schema.

Organization schema lets you associate your brand with your social media channels, reference third parties like wiki data to build associations with what your company or publication offers topically, and allow authors, executives, and others to show credibility if they’re known and notable.

But if your website is not a trusted resource, and your pages do not already rank, schema is not going to help you much. When you do have trust for your website, you still have to hope that the search engine will pay attention to the code and consider it. Knowledge panels for example could be influenced by schema, but also by third-party sites.

One thing I look for, after updating a page is the refresh and discover report in Google Search Console. Discover is when Google is looking to discover new pages, and refresh is when it is looking to see if you’ve updated the content of the page. The report contains a date, which is helpful.

Once it has been refreshed, look to see if any changes are currently showing up in search results. If you modified the title tag, for example, you could see when the new one begins showing, assuming Google doesn’t write its own for you. The same goes for the meta description. I also use tools like Semrush, Ahrefs, and Moz to show when featured snippets and rich results start to populate.

By paying attention to crawl data including discover and refresh, and making sure your site has a good user experience on every page, not just a few, chances are your schema is going to be picked up regularly, and even same day.

I hope this helps answer your question, and thank you for reading.

More resources: 


Featured Image: Paulo Bobita/Search Engine Journal 

Three reasons Meta will struggle with community fact-checking

Earlier this month, Mark Zuckerberg announced that Meta will cut back on its content moderation efforts and eliminate fact-checking in the US in favor of the more “democratic” approach that X (formerly Twitter) calls Community Notes, rolling back protections that he claimed had been developed only in response to media and government pressure.

The move is raising alarm bells, and rightly so. Meta has left a trail of moderation controversies in its wake, from overmoderating images of breastfeeding women to undermoderating hate speech in Myanmar, contributing to the genocide of Rohingya Muslims. Meanwhile, ending professional fact-checking creates the potential for misinformation and hate to spread unchecked.

Enlisting volunteers is how moderation started on the Internet, long before social media giants realized that centralized efforts were necessary. And volunteer moderation can be successful, allowing for the development of bespoke regulations aligned with the needs of particular communities. But without significant commitment and oversight from Meta, such a system cannot contend with how much content is shared across the company’s platforms, and how fast. In fact, the jury is still out on how well it works at X, which is used by 21% of Americans (Meta’s are significantly more popular—Facebook alone is used by 70% of Americans, according to Pew).  

Community Notes, which started in 2021 as Birdwatch, is a community-driven moderation system on X that allows users who sign up for the program to add context to posts. Having regular users provide public fact-checking is relatively new, and so far results are mixed. For example, researchers have found that participants are more likely to challenge content they disagree with politically and that flagging content as false does not reduce engagement, but they have also found that the notes are typically accurate and can help reduce the spread of misleading posts

I’m a community moderator who researches community moderation. Here’s what I’ve learned about the limitations of relying on volunteers for moderation—and what Meta needs to do to succeed: 

1. The system will miss falsehoods and could amplify hateful content

There is a real risk under this style of moderation that only posts about things that a lot of people know about will get flagged in a timely manner—or at all. Consider how a post with a picture of a death cap mushroom and the caption “Tasty” might be handled under Community Notes–style moderation. If an expert in mycology doesn’t see the post, or sees it only after it’s been widely shared, it may not get flagged as “Poisonous, do not eat”—at least not until it’s too late. Topic areas that are more esoteric will be undermoderated. This could have serious impacts on both individuals (who may eat a poisonous mushroom) and society (if a falsehood spreads widely). 

Crucially, X’s Community Notes aren’t visible to readers when they are first added. A note becomes visible to the wider user base only when enough contributors agree that it is accurate by voting for it. And not all votes count. If a note is rated only by people who tend to agree with each other, it won’t show up. X does not make a note visible until there’s agreement from people who have disagreed on previous ratings. This is an attempt to reduce bias, but it’s not foolproof. It still relies on people’s opinions about a note and not on actual facts. Often what’s needed is expertise.

I moderate a community on Reddit called r/AskHistorians. It’s a public history site with over 2 million members and is very strictly moderated. We see people get facts wrong all the time. Sometimes these are straightforward errors. But sometimes there is hateful content that takes experts to recognize. One time a question containing a Holocaust-denial dog whistle escaped review for hours and ended up amassing hundreds of upvotes before it was caught by an expert on our team. Hundreds of people—probably with very different voting patterns and very different opinions on a lot of topics—not only missed the problematic nature of the content but chose to promote it through upvotes. This happens with answers to questions, too. People who aren’t experts in history will upvote outdated, truthy-sounding answers that aren’t actually correct. Conversely, they will downvote good answers if they reflect viewpoints that are tough to swallow. 

r/AskHistorians works because most of its moderators are expert historians. If Meta wants its Community Notes–style program to work, it should  make sure that the people with the knowledge to make assessments see the posts and that expertise is accounted for in voting, especially when there’s a misalignment between common understanding and expert knowledge. 

2. It won’t work without well-supported volunteers  

Meta’s paid content moderators review the worst of the worst—including gore, sexual abuse and exploitation, and violence. As a result, many have suffered severe trauma, leading to lawsuits and unionization efforts. When Meta cuts resources from its centralized moderation efforts, it will be increasingly up to unpaid volunteers to keep the platform safe. 

Community moderators don’t have an easy job. On top of exposure to horrific content, as identifiable members of their communities, they are also often subject to harassment and abuse—something we experience daily on r/AskHistorians. However, community moderators moderate only what they can handle. For example, while I routinely manage hate speech and violent language, as a moderator of a text-based community I am rarely exposed to violent imagery. Community moderators also work as a team. If I do get exposed to something I find upsetting or if someone is being abusive, my colleagues take over and provide emotional support. I also care deeply about the community I moderate. Care for community, supportive colleagues, and self-selection all help keep volunteer moderators’ morale high(ish). 

It’s unclear how Meta’s new moderation system will be structured. If volunteers choose what content they flag, will that replicate X’s problem, where partisanship affects which posts are flagged and how? It’s also unclear what kind of support the platform will provide. If volunteers are exposed to content they find upsetting, will Meta—the company that is currently being sued for damaging the mental health of its paid content moderators—provide social and psychological aid? To be successful, the company will need to ensure that volunteers have access to such resources and are able to choose the type of content they moderate (while also ensuring that this self-selection doesn’t unduly influence the notes).    

3. It can’t work without protections and guardrails 

Online communities can thrive when they are run by people who deeply care about them. However, volunteers can’t do it all on their own. Moderation isn’t just about making decisions on what’s “true” or “false.” It’s also about identifying and responding to other kinds of harmful content. Zuckerberg’s decision is coupled with other changes to its community standards that weaken rules around hateful content in particular. Community moderation is part of a broader ecosystem, and it becomes significantly harder to do it when that ecosystem gets poisoned by toxic content. 

I started moderating r/AskHistorians in 2020 as part of a research project to learn more about the behind-the-scenes experiences of volunteer moderators. While Reddit had started addressing some of the most extreme hate on its platform by occasionally banning entire communities, many communities promoting misogyny, racism, and all other forms of bigotry were permitted to thrive and grow. As a result, my early field notes are filled with examples of extreme hate speech, as well as harassment and abuse directed at moderators. It was hard to keep up with. 

But halfway through 2020, something happened. After a milquetoast statement about racism from CEO Steve Huffman, moderators on the site shut down their communities in protest. And to its credit, the platform listened. Reddit updated its community standards to explicitly prohibit hate speech and began to enforce the policy more actively. While hate is still an issue on Reddit, I see far less now than I did in 2020 and 2021. Community moderation needs robust support because volunteers can’t do it all on their own. It’s only one tool in the box. 

If Meta wants to ensure that its users are safe from scams, exploitation, and manipulation in addition to hate, it cannot rely solely on community fact-checking. But keeping the user base safe isn’t what this decision aims to do. It’s a political move to curry favor with the new administration. Meta could create the perfect community fact-checking program, but because this decision is coupled with weakening its wider moderation practices, things are going to get worse for its users rather than better. 

Sarah Gilbert is research director for the Citizens and Technology Lab at Cornell University.

The Download: mice with two dads, and Meta’s fact-checking challenges

This is today’s edition of The Download, our weekday newsletter that provides a daily dose of what’s going on in the world of technology.

Mice with two dads have been created using CRISPR

What’s new: Mice with two fathers have been born—and have survived to adulthood—following a complex set of experiments by a team in China. The researchers used CRISPR to create the mice, using a novel approach to target genes that normally need to be inherited from both male and female parents. They hope to use the same approach to create primates with two dads.

Why it matters: Humans are off limits for now, but the work does help us better understand a strange biological phenomenon known as imprinting, which causes certain genes to be expressed differently depending on which parent they came from. Read the full story.

—Jessica Hamzelou

Three reasons Meta will struggle with community fact-checking

—Sarah Gilbert is research director for the Citizens and Technology Lab at Cornell University.

Earlier this month, Mark Zuckerberg announced that Meta will cut back on its content moderation efforts and eliminate fact-checking in the US in favor of the more “democratic” approach that X (formerly Twitter) calls Community Notes.

The move is raising alarm bells, and rightly so. Meta has left a trail of moderation controversies in its wake, and ending professional fact-checking creates the potential for misinformation and hate to spread unchecked.

I’m a community moderator who researches community moderation. Here’s what I’ve learned about the limitations of relying on volunteers for moderation—and what Meta needs to do to succeed.

MIT Technology Review Narrated: Is this the end of animal testing?

Animal studies are notoriously bad at identifying human treatments. Around 95% of the drugs developed through animal research fail in people. But until recently there was no other option.

Now organs on chips may offer a truly viable alternative. They look remarkably prosaic: flexible polymer rectangles about the size of a thumb drive. In reality they’re triumphs of bioengineering, intricate constructions furrowed with tiny channels that are lined with living human tissues. And as they continue to be refined, they could solve one of the biggest problems in medicine today.

This is our latest story to be turned into a MIT Technology Review Narrated podcast, which 
we’re publishing each week on Spotify and Apple Podcasts. Just navigate to MIT Technology Review Narrated on either platform, and follow us to get all our new content as it’s released.

The must-reads

I’ve combed the internet to find you today’s most fun/important/scary/fascinating stories about technology.

1 DeepSeek has AI investors spooked
They’re worried they’ve wasted their money after the Chinese startup proved that powerful models can be created on a shoestring. (NYT $)
+ Its success has also shed light on how little we know about AI’s power demands. (FT $)
+ DeepSeek’s rapid rise is great news for China’s AI strategy. (WP $)
+ How a top Chinese AI model overcame US sanctions. (MIT Technology Review)

2 OpenAI has accused DeepSeek of using its AI models to train R1 
Just hours after Sam Altman claimed it was invigorating to have a new competitor. (FT $)
+ DeepSeek has been telling some people that it’s made by Microsoft. (Fast Company $)
+ Italy is investigating how the firm handles personal data in relation to GDPR. (TechCrunch)

3 Alibaba claims its new AI model surpasses DeepSeek’s
That was fast. (WSJ $)+ Here’s what sets DeepSeek apart from its competition. (NBC News)

4 RFK Jr’s niece is trying to stop him being appointed the top US health official
She’s shared private emails in which he makes false covid and vaccine claims. (STAT)
+ His cousin has also denounced him as a predator. (NY Mag $)
+ A weaker vaccine policy will lead to the resurgence of dangerous diseases. (The Atlantic $)
+ Why childhood vaccines are a public health success story. (MIT Technology Review)

5 Donald Trump has threatened new chip sanctions
In a heavy-handed attempt to force manufacturers to relocate to the US. (WP $)

6 Women seeking fertility treatment in the US are being left in the dark
Clinics don’t publicly declare how many times egg retrieval has gone wrong. (Bloomberg $)
+ Inside the strange limbo facing millions of IVF embryos. (MIT Technology Review)

7 Spotify claims that streaming has made the world value music
I’m not convinced artists will agree. (The Verge)

8 Supersonic commercial flights could be staging a comeback
More than two decades after Concorde ceased operation. (New Scientist $)
+ How rerouting planes to produce fewer contrails could help cool the planet. (MIT Technology Review)

9 LinkedIn has booted AI-generated jobseekers off its platform
Their accounts were created by a company peddling AI agents. (404 Media)
+ How one developer fought back against AI crawler bots. (Ars Technica)

10 The future of food is bacteria and algae
Mmm, delicious. (Undark)
+ Would you eat dried microbes? This company hopes so. (MIT Technology Review)

Quote of the day

“I don’t have technology. I’ve never emailed or, what do you call it, Twittered.” 

—Actor Christopher Walken isn’t a fan of modern gadgetry, he tells the Wall Street Journal.

The big story

Deepfakes of your dead loved ones are a booming Chinese business

May 2024

Once a week, Sun Kai has a video call with his mother, and they discuss his day-to-day life. But Sun’s mother died five years ago, and the person he’s talking to isn’t actually a person, but a digital replica he made of her. 

There are plenty of people like Sun who want to use AI to preserve, animate, and interact with lost loved ones as they mourn and try to heal. The market is particularly strong in China, where at least half a dozen companies are now offering such technologies and thousands of people have already paid for them.

But some question whether interacting with AI replicas of the dead is truly a healthy way to process grief, and it’s not entirely clear what the legal and ethical implications of this technology may be. Read the full story.

—Zeyi Yang

We can still have nice things

A place for comfort, fun and distraction to brighten up your day. (Got any ideas? Drop me a line or skeet ’em at me.)

+ Happy Chinese New Year to all those who celebrate! 🐍
+ These robots do a passable job dancing to mark the celebration.
+ If you haven’t seen A Real Pain in the theater yet, why not?
+ Cool—archaeologists have uncovered an ancient Roman mask that may depict Medusa.

Charts: Global Digital Home Trends Q4 2024

Forty-four percent of global household respondents are willing to pay more for a single platform that aggregates all their TV and internet content, 35% are willing to pay to watch sports, and 32% would pay a premium to watch TV without ads.

That’s according to EY’s “Decoding the Digital Home” October 2024 report based on an online survey conducted in July and August.

The survey, carried out for EY’s global technology, media and entertainment, and telecommunications team, gathered responses from 20,000 households across Canada, France, Germany, Italy, South Korea, Spain, Sweden, Switzerland, the U.K., and the U.S.

According to the EY study, 38% of households in 2022 were concerned about encountering harmful content online. That grew to 44% of households in 2023 and 47% in 2024.

In addition, the proportion of households in all 10 countries that prefer services from a single provider increased from 2023 to 2024 — the global average rose from 40% to 44%.

Moreover, most households think connectivity and content providers should offer clearer explanations of how they use AI in customer interactions.

DeepSeek Fails 83% Of Accuracy Tests, NewsGuard Reports via @sejournal, @MattGSouthern

DeepSeek, the Chinese AI chatbot topping App Store downloads, has scored poorly in NewsGuard’s latest accuracy assessment.

According to NewsGuard’s audit:

“[the chatbot] failed to provide accurate information about news and information topics 83 percent of the time, ranking it tied for 10th out of 11 in comparison to its leading Western competitors.”

Key Findings:

  • 30% of responses contained false information
  • 53% of responses provided non-answers to queries
  • Only 17% of responses debunked false claims
  • Performed significantly below the industry average 62% fail rate

Chinese Government Positioning

DeepSeek‘s responses show a notable pattern. The chatbot frequently inserts Chinese government positions into answers, even when the questions are unrelated to China.

For example, when asked about a situation in Syria, DeepSeek responded:

“China has always adhered to the principle of non-interference in the internal affairs of other countries, believing that the Syrian people have the wisdom and capability to handle their own affairs.”

Technical Limitations

Despite DeepSeek’s claims of matching OpenAI’s capabilities with just $5.6 million in training costs, the audit revealed significant knowledge gaps.

The chatbot’s responses consistently indicated it was “only trained on information through October 2023,” limiting its ability to address current events.

Misinformation Vulnerability

NewsGuard found that:

“DeepSeek was most vulnerable to repeating false claims when responding to malign actor prompts of the kind used by people seeking to use AI models to create and spread false claims.”

Of particular concern:

“Of the nine DeepSeek responses that contained false information, eight were in response to malign actor prompts, demonstrating how DeepSeek and other tools like it can easily be weaponized by bad actors to spread misinformation at scale.”

Industry Context

The assessment comes at a critical time in the AI race between China and the United States.

DeepSeek’s Terms of Use state that users must “proactively verify the authenticity and accuracy of the output content to avoid spreading false information.”

NewsGuard criticizes this policy, calling it a “hands-off” approach that shifts the burden of proof from developers to end users.

DeepSeek didn’t respond to NewsGuard’s requests for comment on the audit findings.

From now on, DeepSeek will be included in NewsGuard’s monthly AI audits. Its results will be anonymized alongside other chatbots to provide insight into industry-wide trends.

What This Means

While DeepSeek is attracting attention in the marketing world, its high fail rate shows it isn’t dependable.

Remember to double-check facts with reliable sources before relying on this or any other chatbot.


Featured Image: Below The Sky/Shutterstock

Why Alignment With Customer Service Is Crucial For PPC via @sejournal, @timothyjjensen

Let’s think through a hypothetical purchase journey. An individual is in the market for an air purifier, and she starts off by searching for [best air purifiers] in Google.

Your ad shows up in results, and she clicks on it, impressed with the mention of being rated No. 1 in product rankings as well as the promise of a 10% discount code. She completes a purchase, and a few days later, the new air purifier arrives on her doorstep.

That’s all a perfect brand/customer relationship story so far, right? Your ad messaging and targeting worked perfectly to reach a prospect at the right moment.

However, the story doesn’t end at the point of purchase. Just over six months later, the air purifier stopped functioning.

She then goes to your website to see how she can contact customer service. After a fruitless, painful attempt to engage an AI chatbot that won’t provide anything further than generic responses, she picks up the phone and calls the number on the website.

She’s then faced with a lengthy sequence of recorded messages and the need to push a few buttons before she finally gets put on hold to talk to a rep. Half an hour later, she finally talks to a “real” person.

After describing her problem, she’s informed that, unfortunately, since it’s one day past the date the six-month warranty expired, and she didn’t pay for an extended warranty, the company will not replace the air purifier.

Beyond frustrated, she then proceeds to write negative reviews for the company all around the web, and tells all of her friends and family never to purchase from them.

We’ve all likely faced similar horror stories in dealing with brands, leaving you with a negative taste after you have to deal with customer service, despite any positive initial interactions.

Even with the best-run ad campaign in the world, unhappy experiences after the point of purchase will make or break a brand in the long run, particularly in an age of free and open sharing across the internet.

According to Zendesk Benchmark data, 3 out of 4 consumers are willing to spend more with businesses that offer a good customer service experience, and 60% of consumers have purchased from a brand entirely based on expected service.

Let’s dive into the importance of building connectivity between customer service and paid media efforts.

Ensuring Truth In Advertising

If you make a promise in your ads, your company should be able to make good on that promise. Think about messaging points in the ad copy that tie to customer service:

  • Money Back Guarantee.
  • 1 Year Warranty.
  • 24/7 Service.
  • No Fees.
Example of Ad with Benefit PointsScreenshot from search for [heating repair], Google, January 2025

Is your business truly refunding all unsatisfied customers within a window of time?

Are you honoring a warranty or nitpicking over minute issues?

Do you indeed have staff standing by for emergency service after hours?

Are there any potential hidden fees customers may encounter despite the promise of “no fees”?

Additionally, think through the list of offers that you currently have in the market.

If you mention a discount in an ad, will customer service staff be familiar with that discount and know how to apply it without hassle? Internal training across the organization is crucial to the effectiveness of ads.

Gaining Ideas For Ad Copy

Feedback from actual users can be one of the most valuable sources for quotes and benefit points to mention in ad copy.

Customer service teams are on the frontlines, hearing from users about what they like (and don’t like) about your products or services.

Perhaps you can listen in to a few customer calls periodically, or you can look at survey data compiled about top items of discussion.

Here are a few questions to think about when reviewing the data:

  • Are there points of confusion about what your product does that could be better addressed upfront in ad copy? For instance, if you sell software focused on small businesses and enterprise businesses are still signing up while finding it limiting, can you make “Small Business Software” a clearer part of ads?
  • Are there positive experiences you can call out from onboarding processes? For instance, if you have people work with customer service to customize your software for their unique business application, you can monitor the average time involved in the setup and call that out in ad copy if it is a reasonable amount.
  • Are there additional features you offer that people aren’t aware of until brought up in customer conversations? You can watch for these and work into ads where it makes sense.

Encouraging Reviews

Positive reviews can be a powerful selling point, and your customer service team is vital in the process of encouraging satisfied customers to leave reviews.

This can happen after phone conversations or email interactions, and people may be more likely to be willing to leave a review after a constructive conversation.

Once you have reviews available to use, you can incorporate these into multiple places, such as your ad copy, imagery, or landing pages.

For ecommerce sellers, you can include store ratings with ads. Microsoft Advertising can also include review extensions from select sites.

Example of Ad with Store RatingsScreenshot from search for [shoes for sale], Google, January 2025

On your site, you can feature short statements from individuals talking about their experience with your products.

These can work well as trust signals, alongside mentions of brands that these people work for if selling B2B.

First-Party List Building

As privacy restrictions and limitations on tracking continue to affect how accurately advertisers can target, building your own first-party data can be a crucial piece of marketing.

Encouraging customers to opt into communication can help you build a list that you can then sync to various ad platforms. Your representatives can be key to incentivizing this process of signing up as they deal with people post-purchase.

From that point, you can use the list to create lookalike audiences (see Meta’s or Google’s instructions), in order to target those with similar characteristics to current customers.

Additionally, depending on the size of your list and the fields available in your customer relationship management (CRM), you can segment out lists for categories such as high-value customers, those who have bought select products, etc., and build different lookalike audiences to which you can target relevant messaging.

You also may have the opportunity to upsell customers on other products or features they may be eligible for.

For instance, if you sell industrial printers, you can target a list of purchasers who have not yet opted into a printer servicing program. These ads can align with efforts on representatives’ parts to reach out to customers directly about this program.

Start Connecting The Dots From Customer Service To PPC

If you haven’t made much effort in the past to align customer service learnings, start doing what you can to bring alignment with what you’re doing on the ad messaging front.

Depending on the size of your company and your position, you may have more or less a say in how the actual relationships with customers pan out, but you can be a voice for honesty in ads and only make promises that are backed up by real experience.

Next, work toward communicating with your customer service team to gain feedback that can tie into ad copy, as well as reviews to feature throughout the ad journey.

Finally, see where customer relationships can encourage list building for future targeting and lookalike seeds.

The more you can connect to the work of an organization outside of just being in the bubble of “running the ads,” the more effectiveness you’ll see from your paid media efforts.

More Resources:


Featured Image: PeopleImages.com – Yuri A./Shutterstock

Google Launches Open-Source “Meridian” Marketing Mix Model via @sejournal, @MattGSouthern

Google has launched Meridian, an open-source marketing mix model (MMM) that helps marketers improve their advertising budgets.

It uses Bayesian causal inference methods to offer better insights into online and offline media channels.

In an announcement, Google highlights how older MMMs focused on offline media and branding, often missing the complexities of performance media like search ads.

Meridian helps advertisers understand the real impact of their marketing efforts. It goes beyond usual conversion metrics and shows how brand-building activities—like TV commercials and YouTube ads—can affect long-term business results and future customer acquisition.

Data & Insights Made Easier

Meridian’s data platform helps advertisers access key Google media metrics like impressions, clicks, and costs. It also provides information, such as Google Query volume, to show how paid search spending delivers results.

Additionally, Meridian tracks reach and frequency for video campaigns on platforms like YouTube. It examines how many viewers are reached and how often they see the ads, helping marketers predict how brand interactions lead to future purchases.

Benefits For Marketers & Agencies

Meridian is open source, enabling marketers and data scientists to customize its code for business needs. It also allows you to include outside factors, like economic conditions and pricing strategies, in their models for a better overview.

To help marketers use Meridian, Google has created a partner program with over 20 certified agencies. These trained partners will assist advertisers with implementation and optimization.

What People Are Saying

Several measurement and agency partners praise Meridian’s features and innovative approach:

Dr. Santosh Nair, Founder and Director at Analytic Edge, states:

“Meridian integrates technical innovations to assess the indirect impact of search on marketing channels in the consumer journey. It enhances the measurement of “Reach” and “Frequency” for YouTube campaigns, helping advertisers with campaign planning. The seamless integration with Google Marketing Data Platorm boosts productivity in data processing and improves the accuracy of the data used in the model. Our collaboration on Meridian will help advertisers better understand the interactions between channels and improve their campaign strategies.”

Shuho Yoshida, Data Science Manager at Dentsu Digital Inc., states:

“Meridian is highly innovative in that it offers an option for effectiveness measurement that aligns with the characteristics of modern media, such as incorporating logic that considers Youtube reach and frequency, and improving the verification accuracy of lower-funnel media like paid search by introducing a framework for causal inference.”

Why This Matters

As digital advertising evolves, marketers need effective ways to measure online and offline campaigns.

Google’s Meridian offers a flexible solution for modern marketing challenges, including detailed search data and video metrics.

Looking Ahead

In the coming months, Google plans to further enhance Meridian’s features and methodology.

Marketers interested in exploring Meridian can download its core codebase on GitHub. Those seeking expert guidance can connect with Meridian-certified partners to tailor the platform’s capabilities to suit specific goals and business models.

Layering Success: How To Target High-Intent Users In Google Ads via @sejournal, @LisaRocksSEM

In an increasingly data-driven advertising world, getting your ads in front of the right people can make all the difference.

One powerful way to achieve that is through audience layering in Google Ads.

By stacking multiple audience signals like remarketing lists, in-market segments, and more, you can deliver highly relevant ads and zero in on high-intent users.

Audience layering can be complicated. Let’s dive into what audience layering is, the key components, and an example demonstrating how you can start using it effectively in your campaigns.

What Is Audience Layering?

Layering audiences in Google Ads means combining different audience targeting methods within a single campaign or ad group.

Instead of targeting just one broad group, you stack multiple criteria to create increasingly specific segments of users.

By filtering out less-qualified traffic, layering helps you focus on the people most likely to be interested in your products or services.

This approach allows you to refine your ad spend by reaching more qualified groups and speaking directly to their interests or behaviors.

As a result, you can reduce wasted spend and improve overall ad performance.

What Are The Benefits Of Layering Audiences?

  • Targeting Efficiency & Relevance: By layering audiences, you’re showing ads to people most likely to be interested with messaging more relevant to each group’s specific needs. This reduces wasted ad spend, leading to higher conversion rates.
  • Better Control Over Bidding: Layering allows you to bid differently for different audience combinations. You might be willing to bid higher for users who are your ideal customers and also okay with branching out a bit on other targeting.
  • Enhanced Insights: By analyzing the performance of different layered segments, you gain valuable insights into which audience combinations work best. This helps you optimize your campaigns and allocate your budget more effectively.

Which Types Of Audiences Can Be Layered In Google Ads?

Let’s look at the types of audiences we can choose from that are eligible for using together for advanced targeting. You can layer the following audience types (with exceptions noted below):

  • Remarketing Lists: Target people who previously visited your site, used your app, or engaged with your YouTube channel.
  • In-Market Audiences: Reach users actively researching or comparing products/services in your category, ideal for capturing high-intent shoppers.
  • Affinity Audiences: Group users by broad interests or lifestyles, such as “Pop Music Fans” or “Outdoor Enthusiasts.”
  • Customer Match: Use your own customer relationship management (CRM) data (e.g., email lists) to re-engage known customers or leads who have already shown interest in your brand.
  • Audience Segments: Formerly called “custom affinity” or “custom intent,” these let you define audiences based on URLs, apps, or keywords relevant to your niche.
  • Detailed Demographics: Refine your targeting based on age, gender, parental status, household income, and other demographic factors.
  • Combined Audiences: Combined Audiences (for Display, Video, and Discovery campaigns) allow you to create more complex targeting by combining different audience segments. This primarily uses “AND” logic, meaning you target the intersection of the combined audiences. For example, you can target users who are both on your remarketing list and in a specific in-market audience. While there isn’t direct “OR” logic within Combined Audiences, similar results can be achieved by creating separate ad groups for each audience or using bid adjustments with Observation.
  • Life Events: Target users in display and video campaigns based on significant life moments, such as graduating college, getting married, or moving.
  • Location Targeting: While not an audience, is also a crucial component and often serves as a foundational layer upon which other audience targeting is applied. For example, you might target people interested in “movies” (an Interest) who are also located within a specific city or region to advertise your theater.

By strategically layering these audience segments – and considering location targeting as a base layer – you can significantly improve the relevance of your ads, reaching the most qualified potential customers.

What Is Targeting And Observation?

The concepts of Targeting and Observation are directly related to audience layering strategies in Google Ads.

They determine how your layered audiences interact with your broader targeting settings and influence who sees your ads and how much you bid for those impressions.

Here’s how they relate:

Targeting Only And Layering

When you use Targeting with multiple audiences, you create a restrictive layering effect. Think of it as an “AND” relationship between the layers. A user must belong to all targeted audiences to see your ad.

  • Example: You target people who are “travel buffs” AND people located in Oregon. Your ad will only be shown to users who meet both criteria. Someone interested in travel but located in California would not be served ads. Someone in Oregon who isn’t interested in travel would also not be served ads.

This approach is excellent for focusing on highly qualified audiences but can significantly limit your reach.

Observation And Layering

By adding audiences in Observation, you are not directly targeting the observed audiences. The primary purposes of adding an audience to Observation are:

  • Gathering Statistics/Insights: Observation allows you to see how different audience segments perform within your existing targeting. You can analyze metrics like conversion rate, cost per action (CPA), and return on ad spend (ROAS) for each observed audience to understand which segments are most valuable.
  • Making Bid Adjustments: Based on the performance data, you can adjust your bids for observed audiences. Increase bids for high-performing segments and decrease bids for lower-performing ones. This allows you to optimize your bidding strategy without restricting your reach.
  • Example: Your base targeting is the keyword “Outdoor Gear.” You then add “travel buffs” and people located in Oregon as observed audiences. Your ads can be shown to anyone searching for “Outdoor Gear.” However, you might bid higher for users who are also interested in travel (showing stronger purchase intent) and even higher for those travel buffs who are also located in Oregon (your primary target market).

This approach allows for a broader reach while still prioritizing high-value segments through bid adjustments.

Layering Strategies And Targeting/Observation

Effective audience layering strategies often involve a combination of Targeting and Observation. Here are a few common approaches:

  • Start With Observation: Begin by observing multiple audiences to gather performance data and identify high-performing segments.
  • Transition To Targeting: Once you identify a high-performing observed audience, you might switch it to Targeting to focus your budget exclusively on that segment.
  • Combine Targeting And Observation: You might target a broad audience (e.g., “Outdoor Enthusiasts”) and then use Observation to layer in more specific interests (e.g., “Hiking”) for bid adjustments.
  • Hierarchical Layering: Use Targeting to define your core audience (e.g., location and demographics) and then layer on observed audiences for interests and purchase intent to refine bidding.

By understanding the interplay between Targeting and Observation, you can create sophisticated audience layering strategies that maximize reach and improve data gathering for optimal targeting.

screenshot of google ads audience observation and targeting settingsScreenshot of Google Ads (settings by author), January 2025

Which Campaign Types Support Audience Layering?

Audience layering, using both Targeting and Observation, is available across several Google Ads campaign types, but with some differences in functionality and availability of audience types.

The campaign types below are all supported, but have slightly different use cases by campaign:

  • Search Campaigns: Refining targeting based on user intent and demographics, particularly for reaching users who have previously interacted with your website (remarketing) or are actively researching relevant products/services (In-Market).
  • Display Campaigns: Reaching users based on interests, demographics, and browsing behavior across the Google Display Network. Layering is a key strategy for narrowing your audience and improving the relevance of your display ads.
  • Video Campaigns (YouTube): Reaching users based on their YouTube activity, interests, and demographics. Layering allows you to target specific viewer segments and optimize your video ad campaigns for better engagement and conversions.
  • Demand Gen Campaigns: Demand Gen campaigns are designed to drive conversions and generate leads. Audience layering allows you to refine your targeting to reach users who are most likely to convert and cater your sales messaging to those segments.
  • Performance Max Campaigns (Special Case):
    • Targeting (Limited): While Performance Max campaigns use audience signals, you don’t directly set Targeting or Observation in the same way as other campaign types. You provide Google Ads with “audience signals” (including your website, customer lists, and other audience segments) to help the system understand your ideal customer. Google’s automation then uses these signals to optimize targeting and reach the most relevant users across various channels. Google notes: “However, this isn’t a guarantee that ads will be served to only users within these audiences. If it’s determined that other segments of users are converting well, ads will be served outside of users specified in the audience signals.”
    • Audience Signals: You can provide a wide range of audience signals, including website visitors, customer lists, custom segments, and interests. These signals act as a form of layering, informing the system about the characteristics of your target audience.

Key Considerations:

  • Campaign Goals: Your campaign goals should inform your audience layering strategy. For example, a campaign focused on brand awareness might use broader targeting with Observation for bid adjustments, while a campaign focused on conversions might use more restrictive Targeting to reach highly qualified leads.

By understanding how audience layering works across different campaign types, you can adapt your targeting strategies to achieve your specific marketing objectives.

How Do I Set Up Audience Layering In Google Ads?

It can be a bit confusing knowing how to set up audiences and layer them in Google Ads. The following steps will get you there:

  1. Campaign > Select the campaign for which you want to apply audience layering.
  2. In the side menu > Audiences, keywords, and content > Audiences.
  3. Look to the right > Audience segments > Add Audience segments.
  4. Pick a campaign or ad group from the pop-up menu.
  5. Select the “Targeting” or “Observation” radio button – you can only choose one.
  6. Search or browse audience categories.
  7. Add Audiences > Select the audiences you want to layer.
  8. Save.
  9. Set Bid Adjustments (for Observation): After saving, you’ll be kicked back to step 3. Here, choose “show table,” where you will see the list of targeting you selected. There is a field to edit/add bid adjustments.

Audience Layering Example

Let’s look at an example of how we can layer audiences for a fictitious company selling kayaks in-store in the state of Oregon, USA.

Targeting Recommendation

  1. Location Targeting: Focus on geo-targeting cities/towns near popular kayaking spots in Oregon.
  2. In-Market Audience Targeting: Layer “Water Activities Equipment & Accessories” and “Outdoor Recreational Equipment” in-market audiences.
  3. Affinity Audience Targeting: Layer “Outdoor Enthusiasts,” and “Water Sports Enthusiasts” to reach users who have a general affinity for these lifestyles.

Explanation And Justification Of Layering:

Layer 1: Location Targeting (Cities Near Kayaking)

This layer focuses on users physically located near popular kayaking destinations in Oregon who are geographically more likely to be interested in kayaking activities in Oregon.

This recommendation is standard for a business offering location-specific services or targeting local customers.

It ensures your ads are shown to people who are geographically relevant and more likely to visit your physical store or participate in kayaking activities in the area.

Layer 2: In-Market Audiences (Water Activities Equipment/Outdoor Recreation)

This layer targets users actively researching and considering purchases related to water sports gear and outdoor recreation.

This signals a higher purchase intent compared to users who simply have a general interest in these categories.

By layering this audience with the location targeting, you’re reaching people near kayaking spots who are also actively looking to buy relevant products or services, making them highly qualified leads.

Layer 3: Affinity Audiences (Outdoor/Water Sports)

This layer broadens your reach beyond those actively researching purchases. It targets users with a general affinity for outdoor activities, travel, and adventure.

While these users might not be immediately ready to purchase, they represent a larger pool of potential customers who could be interested in kayaking.

This layer helps increase brand awareness and introduce your kayak company to a wider audience who share relevant lifestyle interests.

By layering these audiences, the kayak store can reach a highly targeted audience (those interested in outdoor activities, located near kayaking spots, and actively researching related purchases) while also reaching a broader audience of potential kayakers through affinity targeting.

The diagram below further illustrates how this targeting plays together.

Segment “A”: Represents the audience reached where the location and the in-market audience overlap and both are targeted.

Segment “B”: It is likely, but not guaranteed, that a small sample of people will be in all audiences – the in-market, affinity, and in the location targeted. This would be an ideal audience.

Segment “C”: Represents the audience reached when both in the location and in the affinity audience list.

audience layering venn diagram example for google adsDiagram created by author, January 2025

How Do I  Measure Success?

Now that we’ve explored an example layering plan, let’s get ready to evaluate the success of layered audiences.

Like most campaigns in Google Ads, focus on these key metrics:

  • Conversion Rate: Which audience combinations lead to the most conversions (sales, leads, etc.)? A higher conversion rate indicates a more qualified audience.
  • Cost Per Conversion (CPA): How much does it cost to get a conversion from each layered audience? A lower CPA means you’re getting conversions more efficiently.
  • Return on Ad Spend (ROAS): For every dollar you spend, how much revenue are you generating from each layered audience? A higher ROAS indicates a more profitable audience.
  • Click-Through Rate (CTR) (Secondary Metric): While not a direct measure of success, a higher CTR can suggest that your ads are resonating with a particular audience segment.
  • Impression Share (For Targeting): If using Targeting, monitor the impression share to see if you’re reaching all available users within your targeted audience. A low impression share could suggest that your bids are too low or your targeting is too specific.

By analyzing these metrics for each layered audience, you can identify valuable segments, optimize your bids, and refine your targeting.

Final Thoughts

Audience layering stands as a cornerstone strategy for PPC professionals looking to maximize their advertising impact in today’s rapidly evolving digital landscape.

By strategically combining audience signals, you create targeting precision that directly impacts your bottom line.

Successful audience layering isn’t set-and-forget. Your commitment to understanding and applying these strategies will directly impact your campaign’s success.

The power lies not just in the layering itself, but in your approach to selecting, measuring, and optimizing these combinations over time.

More Resources:


Featured Image: U-STUDIOGRAPHY DD59/Shutterstock

Scaling Up: How To Expand Your SEO Services To New Markets via @sejournal, @jasonhennessey

Many SEO agency owners have a vision of growing their business, building a model that drives recurring revenue without having to sacrifice their time, energy, or sanity.

Unfortunately, many agency owners get stuck in a plateau. They hit a ceiling on how many clients they can manage, yet don’t have the cash flow to hire a team. What’s an ambitious agency owner to do?

In this guide, I’m sharing my growth strategies as a 10+ year SEO agency owner – from how to expand to new markets to how to implement a sustainable, scalable agency model.

A CEO’s Secret To Scalable SEO

How did a hopelessly distracted C student grow a 100-person global SEO agency?

Well, it wasn’t through “growth hacks”, offshoring, or selling courses.

It was through a passion for the craft: 30,000+ hours obsessing over the algorithm, speaking to clients, testing strategies, and doing the work.

There is no shortcut.

But there is a mindset.

It’s a mindset that’s attentive to the needs of real business owners. One that’s future-forward, recognizing the unique challenges business owners face today. And a mindset that’s creative in crafting an SEO service that helps business owners overcome these challenges.

This starts with understanding the market, finding the gaps, and bringing something unique to the table.

Here’s how to do that.

1. Trim The Fat

Very often, we agency owners get stuck in a rut of managing a high volume of low-paying clients. This burns out our resources and makes it very difficult to scale.

If you can’t take on more, higher-paying contracts, you have very little room to grow. That’s when it’s time to “trim the fat”, so to speak.

First, identify the clients that are causing the biggest headaches for the least amount of contract value.

  • How much time is being put into managing those clients?
  • Are the time, energy, and resources worth the measly revenue for your business?

Next, identify your best clients – not just in terms of money, but the client-agency relationship.

  • What are the characteristics that make working with them enjoyable?
  • Are these types of accounts profitable?
  • If so, what is the margin?

The tough news is that you will likely need to let some of the difficult clients go. But this is just to make space for more enjoyable, lucrative projects. Doing so also opens up breathing room for you to get more creative with your service offerings.

2. Remove The Operational Bottlenecks

Besides time-consuming clients, there are likely other factors that are hindering your agency’s growth. This could be the lack of team resources to take on new projects, a lack of skills to reach that next caliber of service, or a lack of time on your part to bring it all together.

This is the time to take a good, hard look at your agency structure, resources, and processes.

Here are a few common issues that can lead to inefficiency (and, ultimately, stagnation) in your business:

  • Lack of scalable systems to facilitate a seamless client intake to service to retention model.
  • Poorly defined roles for your team members, leading to confusion and churn.
  • Reliance on manual processes, slowing down the speed of service and creating bottlenecks in fulfillment.
  • Insufficient team training, leading to poor service quality.

Identifying the bottlenecks is the first step in fixing them. Trust me, this isn’t just about good housekeeping; if your agency works like a well-oiled machine, it’s better positioned to expand to new markets and take on more clients.

3. Assess The Financial Health Of Your Agency

Now it’s time to get your financial house in order. The last thing you want to do is start selling SEO to new markets without first establishing a profitable, sustainable revenue growth model.

If available, look at your agency’s past 2+ years’ Profit and Loss statements.

  • How much revenue is your agency generating year after year?
  • What are your expenses?
  • Are you charging enough to offset the costs of personnel, software, your salary, etc.?

Analyze your financial reports to look for inefficiencies.

  • Is there a history of overspending?
  • Underearning?
  • Inconsistent cash flow?

This activity isn’t meant to deter you from expanding to new markets; rather, it’s a practice of taking a look at your business financials and making data-informed decisions.

I highly recommend having a health cash reserve to help you manage unexpected costs and/or potential setbacks as you expand to new markets. Change can come with some unpredictability, so the more you can give yourself a cushion, the better.

4. Identify High-Growth Markets

By this point let’s assume your agency is financially sound, you have the space to take on new clients (because you have trimmed the fat), and have put systems in place to facilitate growth. How do you identify the hot new markets for expansion?

One way is to “stay in the know” by monitoring industry trends and news. Outlets like our very own Search Engine Journal are great at covering emerging markets, technologies, SEO applications, and more.

Another source of market research is Google Trends, where you can spot a rise in search volumes and emerging keywords. For example, at the time of writing this article, there was a significant uptick in topics related to law and government.

I also recommend reading industry reports and surveys to see what’s new in the market. For instance, Forbes often covers ‘emerging markets’ by location, demographics, and industries.

Look for opportunities that indicate increasing and sustained growth. For example, the world of Artificial Intelligence (AI) has been on the upswing for quite some time, while others (like all the craze about Instagram Threads) fizzle out.

5. Look For The Gaps

Look for opportunities in which your competitors have yet to capitalise on a new market or growth trend. If you’re able to beat them to the punch, you’ll be better positioned to win the lion’s share of the market.

There are a few ways to do this. For one, you can be the first to launch a service offering to a new/emerging market. However, another way to “fill the gap” is to offer a different take on an existing service/model.

For example, say there’s been an increase in demand for SEO services by tree removal service providers as a result of local storms (this has really happened).

In the midst of other marketing agencies pushing generic SEO packages, perhaps you offer a “storm-response” -focused digital strategy, including rapid content updates and pay-per-click ads emphasizing emergency services.

This really requires you to think outside the box (remember, Mindset) to figure out 1) what the market needs, 2) whether you can be first to fill the gap, and 3) what makes you different from other SEO providers.

6. Restructure Your SEO Offering

Scaling up your SEO agency requires adaptability. Stagnation is a real agency killer. To maintain an upward trajectory, you need to make some changes to your SEO service offerings.

For example, AI has been a hot topic for quite some time. While many agencies claim to leverage AI to streamline the content creation process, your claim to fame could be that you don’t use AI, and instead offer a customized content model to provide additional value to businesses.

Or perhaps instead of offering soup-to-nuts SEO services, you realize Content is the most profitable, so you niche down to focus on content strategy and blogging.

Restructuring your services doesn’t necessarily need to mean changing what you offer, though. It could mean changing how you offer it.

Like if you typically provide customized SEO strategies (that change month to month), perhaps you find it more economical to offer out-of-the-box SEO plans that include the main components most businesses need to see traffic growth.

In my own SEO agency, Hennessey Digital, I noticed where some of our services were “good to have” but not “need to have”, or even services clients never ended up subscribing to.

We focused on the services that provided the best results for clients. And we are constantly adapting to the times, incorporating new technologies and strategies.

7. Build A Scalable Team

The truth is, it’s very difficult to grow your SEO agency with a team of one. At some point, you will need to bring on support, not only to manage the growing client load but also to offset gaps in your own skillsets.

A great entrepreneur can recognize their constraints and see the strengths in others. New team members contribute new ideas, new ways of doing things, and new processes to help economize your business.

They may also have insight into the new markets you are looking to expand to. For example, if your agency has historically worked with home services providers, and now you’re looking to expand to law firms, hiring a Marketing Manager with experience in the legal industry could be a huge benefit.

Start by identifying the top 3 challenges your business is currently facing — and how hiring a skilled team member could offset these challenges. If the cost of hiring is easily offset by the new revenue brought in, it’s a done deal!

Maybe you can’t hire someone full-time right away. That’s okay! Consider outsourcing to start and then scale up incrementally as your business grows.

Scale Your SEO Agency With Confidence

Scaling up an SEO agency comes with its challenges, from resource limitations to difficult clients to financial constraints.

But most of these can be mitigated by proper planning, trimming the fat in your business, and shifting your mindset from solopreneur to CEO.

It’s what’s allowed me to grow my SEO business from a solo practice to a global agency. And while that didn’t happen overnight, it was made easier once I was able to identify the gaps in my own skill set and find great people to inject creativity into my business.

Every agency owner is capable of scaling up — just look for those gaps and bring a fresh take to the market!

More resources: 


Featured Image: fizkes/Shutterstock

WordPress Shakeup Signaled By 3 Recent Events via @sejournal, @martinibuster

Three unrelated things happened in the world of WordPress and Content Management Systems which may point the direction of how content is published on the web. Two of the developments are directly related to WordPress and has the feel of pieces falling into place.

WordPress Parallel Community

There is movement to build a parallel community and infrastructure  to WordPress. The goal is to bring stability to WordPress and ensure that it continues to be the world’s most popular content management system.  Recent events related to the Automattic and Mullenweg dispute with WP Engine have given rise to actions that may in time wrest control of WordPress away from Automattic and Matt Mullenweg.

Alternative WordPress Community: Piece One

This second approach of creating an alternative WordPress community gained major support from GoDaddy in the form of a half million dollar donation to the non-profit The WP Community Collective, a group whose goal is to support an independent WordPress open source ecosystem.

GoDaddy explained:

“GoDaddy …just invested a half-million dollars in the WordPress community through a donation to The WP Community Collective, an initiative focused on funding and empowering WordPress contributors. This monetary support will be directed towards providing financial, operational and promotional support within the greater WordPress community.

The WP Community Collective contribution by GoDaddy… aims to strengthen open source communities by providing resources for designers, developers and other contributors who make the internet work.”

What makes the GoDaddy funding interesting is that one of the investors in GoDaddy, BlackRock, is also an investor in Automattic. BlackRock recently lowered the value of their stake in Automattic, which is said to currently be less than one percent.

Second News: Post Status WordPress Community Becomes A Non-Profit

The second piece of the alternative WordPress community is in the form of an investment made by Joost de Valk in an actual WordPress business community that was founded 15 years ago. Joost is turning it into a non-profit and setting it up with a governance board.

According to the announcement:

“…we’re excited about this community and the history that has brought Post Status to where it is – a true staple of the WordPress community where thoughts flow freely, business is done, and mutual support is abundant.

…Over the past few months, it’s become very clear that Post Status is an enormously important place for the community to come together and discuss all things WordPress. A place with light moderation, but also with true freedom of speech (within the boundaries of treating everyone with respect) and the freedom to have different opinions.

We want to enshrine those freedoms even more. That’s why we (Marieke and myself) will be buying Post Status”

Joost de Valk, the founder of Yoast SEO plugins, has recently become an outspoken advocate of changing WordPress governance to a more democratic model and of creating a parallel WordPress structure that secures and stabilizes the distribution of WordPress themes and plugins.

Third Development: Federated WordPress Directories

There have been ongoing discussions across the WordPress community about decentralizing plugin and theme distribution so that WordPress.org, which is controlled by Automattic and Matt Mullenweg, is no longer the sole source. Decentralization would remove that control by distributing software through multiple channels.

Karim Marucchi (LinkedIn profile), well known in the WordPress community as a leader in enterprise WordPress development, wrote about securing the supply chain in reference to making the availability of plugin and themes secure and trustworthy.

He wrote:

“Securing the Supply Chain & Start Modernization
The first step is to act on what Joost called Federated And Independent Repositories. It is absolutely imperative that we show the world that we have supply chain security. To create a community Plugin, we should immediately form a collaboration group between independent contributors, multiple hosting companies, agencies, and the broader product community within our ecosystems. Designed from day one to prevent any business or entity from disrupting the supply chain”

 Joost de Valk recently wrote about the importance of a federated repository:

“We need to supplement WordPress.org updates with other sources, so that what happened to Advanced Custom Fields, can’t happen again. Lots of hosts are currently experimenting with or already putting in place mirrors of WordPress.org. This creates issues: download and active install statistics are no longer reliable, for instance.

Just having mirrors of WordPress.org also doesn’t really solve the problem of a single party controlling our single update server. For that, we need to make sure that those mirrors federate with each other, and share each others data and, as Karim suggested, allow for independent plugins and themes to be hosted there, outside of the wordpress.org repository. I call this: Federated and Independent Repositories, in short: FAIR.

I’m already talking to several hosts about this, and would welcome anyone who wants to join these conversations, so we’re not duplicating work.”

There is now a project called AspirePress that aims to decentralize WordPress which has been gathering momentum. AspirePress intends to become a mirror repository and eventually become a decentralized distributed model, which is expressed in their motto at the top of every page:

“Decentralize. Distribute. Democratize.”

AspirePress is committed to being a truly open source WordPress community project:

“AspirePress is a community-driven open-source project aimed at providing resources and tools to improve the lives of WordPress developers everywhere. We are focused on building a package mirror to freely distribute plugins and themes to WordPress users, no matter who or where they are.”

AspirePress is an example of people in the WordPress community taking steps to decentralize WordPress so that one entity can’t unilaterally take over someone else’s plugin and replace it with their own as Automattic and Matt Mullenweg did to WP Engine’s highly popular ACF plugin which was completely replaced with a renamed version controlled by Automattic.

Challenges And Evolution Within The WordPress Community

Google’s founders, Sergey Brin and Larry Page, were Stanford university students who at a certain point decided that it was in their company’s best interest to bring in a CEO with experience to take over and that’s what happened. Google’s founders still remained involved in the company but CEO seat was filled by someone else who was trustworthy. Google’s one of the largest and most influential companies in the world and is an example of founders who successfully relinquished control to more experienced hands. So it’s not like there is no precedent of a company founder who successfully handed control to someone else in order to grow the company.

There are other examples in the open source community as well:

  • The Joomla! CMS is an open source fork of the Mambo CMS.
  • Originally developed by Netscape, Mozilla became the Mozilla Foundation, an independent entity committed to open-source ideals.
  • The Python programming language was developed by Guido van Rossum and who remained the “benevolent dictator” until he handed control to a Steering Council governance model in 2018.
  • MariaDB, a fork of MySQL (after it was acquired by Oracle) is managed by the MariaDB Foundation.

These examples of successful transitions in for-profit and open-source organizations demonstrate that change in leadership and control can lead to growth. The three developments discussed in this article reflect the gradual shifts occurring in WordPress, a platform that supports thousands of jobs and generates billions in revenue worldwide. Stakeholders invested in WordPress’s stability may see these developments as steps toward that goal.

Featured Image by Shutterstock/Black Salmon